Don't feel too bad sushi, I've experienced secondhand many times that there are girls that just enjoy getting attention from a whole group of friends at once. She's trash and you're better off than the guy she's dating.
I know, it's hard for me. I'm working on it though and the road is wonky. The sad thing is that I actually would like to love a person and I have a lot to give (at least that's what I think), but I have a weird feeling I might not do that during my earthly time.
Or maybe the time is not right.
I think I might've broke up with my bf I've known for like 7 years but idk yet. Very upset, dunno what I'm doing anymore, what I was working towards or anything.
I feel calm for now, but very lost.
Surprised at the length here, with an OP that details Love in the common portrayal.
An elusive word. Love is horrible. When I use "Love" below, I am using the romantic kind in movies and teenage bathrooms.
The romantic "Love" conditions aren't within our control, at least the common portrayal.
If you have appeals as to why some of us are born ugly or beautiful - that it is the shape of your soul - then sure,
make a mystic appeal as to why some people are unlovable. Maybe their soul is black.
But facts are facts; the ugly don't love.
And if you ever were loved, no matter how pretty of a personality you may have,
it rests upon your beauty. Beauty that is mostly outside of your control.
When do you draw a line between that which is you and that which is not?
When you see the artificial structure romantic "Love" tries to bulldoze into you, and look at gentle memories of those unloved, it seems there are far more interesting things to contemplate. To bestow, things that could be accessible to all.
If you want capital L Love, it can only exist in absence of alluring youth. True platonic love. Lust and love are incompatible.
This isn't to say that I don't wish for some youth, looks, whatever. But the central melancholy is that, if these are the columns by which we live, then we will always lose to those greater than us. To be replaceable. What's the point?
You can see that the appeal of the soul is what you'd hope to distinguish - I'm not sure, I think the lucidity the internet provides can no longer let these thoughts lull us. Love isn't compatible. And the internet shows the curled child. I'm sorry
If you're going for the foundation of these things, it's worth noting that personality and life experiences are shaped by your heritage and genes as much as your physical appearance is. A very plain person might not have had the opportunities in life to find out about their hobbies, travel, or flesh out their way of thinking; yet it's still possible for others to be attracted to them exactly because of the particular personality they have, isn't it? It's the same with beauty. I'm not going to claim it's not a contest, because it is at the core, but there's many opportunities to find happiness. And just like with what you call the "soul", there's opportunities to work on your appearance, because it isn't a fixed thing set in stone.
It might sound lofty to claim you're liking others for what they've achieved rather than what they were given in life, but if you're going against what naturally attracts you (whether in terms of appearance and personality), forcing yourself to look for someone with more "interesting" characteristics, then are you looking for happiness or just intellectual satisfaction?
>>11136>yet it's still possible for others to be attracted to them exactly because of the particular personality they have, isn't it? It's the same with beauty.
You have a point - just is easier for me to write off the possible circumstances in which this could be true. With the level of hive-mindedness many operate on, and how that bakes into you at a fundamental level, which you acknowledge:>but if you're going against what naturally attracts you (whether in terms of appearance and personality)
It just seems the conditions you would have to meet, the likelihood someone likes you, for you, seems near to zero. And liking you, for you - well, what does that mean anyway? You must ask yourself what exactly are you hoping for in some other person, which you ask:>forcing yourself to look for someone with more "interesting" characteristics, then are you looking for happiness or just intellectual satisfaction?
Well, considered me defeated, but no longer do I search for "someone" because there's no adequate answer as to why there needs to be an absolute Other when you pierce the veil of romantic "love." Since romantic "love" still seems to me arbitrary - rigidly obedient to the zeitgeist - that very zeitgeist that impresses itself upon our "natural" order, ourselves… it's just something I no longer care to entertain, since it's buried around "what if's" and the brutality of competition. And the competition is not always relevant to the effort you could put in. Some things you simply cannot provide nor fulfill in beauty, desire of it. Unconditional love is lost, which isn't necessarily something to admonish (why do we deserve anything?), but one must acknowledge that conditions can always be more favorably satisfied with another one, someone other than you. And this isn't something to admonish either when standing as an alone fact - it is only depressing when you realize the competition is contingent on many things, which may be outside of your control. You can't win by effort alone, and to be "settled" for seems to be the most depressing idea.
It's also necessary to clarify that I don't see myself as someone above natural desires or wanting romantic "love" - in fact sometimes I hate the fact I want the very things that the zeitgeist pushes out. Entertaining romantic "love" is trying to appease an endless desire in all of us, which is why there's only melancholy for those that continue to search instead of yield to the fact that it's unsolvable. It only then seems best to not even raise the questions, to not logically render a way in which whoever chose you, chose you because you succeeded, you were successful - no, to preserve your sanity it's probably best to not even bring up such topics. Either you have something, or you don't - and it may fade away, or it won't - and it may mean everything, or not, and it may be genuine, but also forgotten.
All one could hope for is for others who make the world interesting. But you don't need others to that end. Make the world interesting yourself. You could call it intellectual satisfaction if you'd like, but I think "interesting" as a word stands on its own. And it's not necessarily something to burden yourself with, to search for it. Often it seems that you'll stumble into it when you aren't searching. To search is to get stuck from my experience. To search for Happiness - well what do you do once you get it? Searching segments the continuous nature of living. Happiness is another horrible word in my opinion. It is too vague.
In short, no more need for others to accept you, for you. There is only one person who can do that. It's yourself. In many cases romantic "love" acts as a substitutional answer for something far more simple and direct.
I had a friend that used love as their new deity, and anguished to the point of suicide when things didn't work out. It seems often people pray to the deity of Love, to grace them for many different things, but all could be summed up as finding a way to make life interesting again. That's dependent on you.
>>11129>But facts are facts; the ugly don't love.>And if you ever were loved, no matter how pretty of a personality you may have,>it rests upon your beauty. Beauty that is mostly outside of your control.
I'm not exaggerating when I say that literally everyone I've ever met who said something like that has either been an asshole, autistic, insane, or some mix of the three. The reason people on imageboards don't get dates is not that they're ugly; it's that they're the sort of people who use imageboards.
Infatuation isn't love. I think part of the huge divorce rates is the prevalence of this immature concept of love as infatuation, which leads to a death of love. >>11168
is absolutely right in their assessment. If your idea of love is based on the arbitrary legalisms of which incels are so inclined, then what you are after isn't love but a demonic phantasm of it.
Love grows where the binding of hearts does, absent any superficial regards like beauty. Sexy legs last a day, a sexy soul lasts forever. The unbreakable bonds of a true romantic love do not come from a momentary inclination or from an infatuation, but come from the growth of trust and hope that are forged through honesty, truth, and intimacy between two hearts - to fully expose your whole self to a person, and for them to do the same for you. True romantic love is seen in those relationships between a man and woman who in old age have had a happy and rich marriage for the many years they've been together, holding no secrets from each other but knowing and sharing their whole selves with each other so that they might in a way be one flesh. Marriage is a reflection of this true kind of love.
But this love calls to a deeper and more transcendental love that goes above and beyond human expectations, the kind of perfect love that God has for his creation:
"Love is patient, love is kind, it is not envious. Love does not brag, it is not puffed up. It is not rude, it is not self-serving, it is not easily angered or resentful. It is not glad about injustice, but rejoices in the truth. It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things."
There is no greater love than to lay down one's life for a friend.
I hope that peace and love will be in abundance for every sushi here today and forevermore.
I must just be a broken person because nothing in this thread makes any sense to me. I'd like to have a love but it's all a mystery to me. I thought at one point it would come with time but it never did
almost all of your flings were contingent on their beauty. The personality only factors AFTER they pass that initial test. Sometimes an ugly personality can turn you away, sure - but you would never consider someone who was ugly initially.
If you can type with sincere ardor that you love someone for who they are even if they were attached to a metal lung and drooling out of their mouth, then consider yourself all high and mighty and better than me. Or go ahead and play linguistic games, redefine what love means. Sincerely enjoy your reality, I'm not a part of it, and I could only wish to see things this way.>>11174
Love is a spook, you're fine the way you are. You're only reading the inflatable memories that'll all pass. You're better than everyone here
>>11175>You're better than everyone here
Not nice of you, sushi
I love my bf and when I first met him in meatspace I thought he was kinda ugly tbh. Still love him to bits tho.
I think if I met him somewhere else beforehand, we would've just been friends. But now that I think about it, that's exactly how we were online at first too, just friends. Perhaps it would've ended the same way, with us growing closer and closer over time.
I don't really disagree with you though, it's harder to love and be loved when you're ugly.
>metal lung and drooling
That's more of a disability than just being ugly. You can still put a very sexy person in a metal lung or have them drool disgustingly or something. It could impact a friendship depending on what you want to get out of the friendship. But I think a better example would've been something like someone who's had reconstructive facial surgery or other things that result in facial disfigurements.
>You're better than everyone here
I promise you I'm not, I'm a pathetic person
>>11175> almost all your flings…
I know this guy who is ugly as sin, has a face that's twisted into something resembling a smiling oni. Despite his exterior he is an honest guy. And the dude has a wife (9/10) who cannot stop going on about how great he is.
If beauty were the first and most important factor like internet losers are telling you, then how did this guy get a gf, let alone a wife? There are countless examples out there, like a 4'5" marrying a 6'8". Looks are not the most important factor to dating, and especially not important in long-term committed relationships. Anyone who tells you that you can't get a gf because you don't look like a demigod is a liar.
Short term relationships (flings) are themselves a malicious construct of our hypersexualized culture. You don't need sex to be fulfilled, you don't need a romantic relationship to be happy. Furthermore, pursuing short relationships built around and for sex and sex alone is a foolhardy pursuit. If you want love you pursue a long-term relationship, where the most important factors to getting one is the ability to support, cherish, and trust your partner (and in turn be trustworthy) - in other words to have a beautiful soul. If you want sex and relationships based around how good you look then sure, go to a brothel and have your fill, but you need a beautiful body not a beautiful soul to succeed in those kinds of relationships. Oftentimes the people in this sex-obsessed sphere of relationships have hideous souls, their first concern is their next fix, not the well-being of their partner. They will discard partners like a used rag once the relationship becomes inconvenient for them.
> metal lung
This is less an example of beauty and more an example of disability. A one-sided relationship where one partner gives everything while the other only takes is very undesirable for a long-term relationship, which is why manchildren, playboys, and the severely disabled are not usually able to find those kinds of relationships. I agree that being physically revolting does starve you of a good first impression, but unless you've been disfigured by an acid attack you're unlikely to face any troubles. The only people truly concerned with looks however are the superficial. Incels and manchildren are undesirable for a long-term relationship exactly because they expect the world from their partner while providing absolutely nothing in exchange. A one-sided relationship is a horrible relationship, yet strikingly common for those who only want a relationship for the sake of sex or status. Who that is wise wants to be in a serious relationship with someone who's only defining trait is their passion for video games? This concerns only matters of romantic relationships however, other forms of love do not have concerns for this (like the love of neighbour, familial love, or the love of God).
> so you think you're better than me
No. This isn't a competition and I'm not a good being. I want you to understand that being flawed isn't a problem, and I want you to know about and pursue a truer love that is more meaningful than the kind of "love" you've been taught to seek out. Being loved for and in spite of flaws is one of the hallmarks of this truer love. God loved us enough to die for us while we were still against Him, and he continues to loves us even when we continue to reject Him. His love for us is unconditional, and so is the true kind of love that is worth pursuing.
Look for a woman who loves you for you regardless of what you do and you've found something more precious than all the stars in the heavens.
Sorry for the post if it comes off as uncomfy. I think it's necessary to spell this out, to shatter the illusion that hollywood, incels, playboys, and the depraved continue to perpetuate.>>11179
The best relationships are forged from the bonds of friendship. I wish you both a fruitful relationship that can bear the hardness of life, and that you will both continue to grow in closeness and honesty with each other.
>>11175>love is a spook
Love is an emergent biophysical sensation, I assure you it's very real, even as I push it to the side, try to put it out of mind, it's imprinted it's patterns on me, reminding me of my relation to the world as I dialectally fail to escape it, as I develop further. And work day and night to replace the void fizzling away from love game me. I can feel my mind screaming at me that my body is falling apart, that I'm dying, ringing in my ears with no hearing loss proof positive of my psychosomatic condition. because of vulnerability left by the void, like a cavity and a tooth infection, but it's just gross like exposed organs, dangerous, risks death.
Things are very real, especially when you're confronting death, when you understand this perhaps you'll have the courage or confidence to stop your confused Victor Frankenstein cargo cult interpretations of confused isolated political philosophers who never did anything revolutionary in their entire lives (gee I wonder why) and begin to make strides in developing your stunted growth. Get a wider range of experience.
It's just really sad to see people waving around their reddit tier nihilistic pseudomaterialist bullshit. Like a rotting skunk corpse on a stick, chunks of it's flesh flying off from the inertial force. ">Imagine the smell", as they say. wwwwwwwwwwww
I had a dream where I was together with him, on our way to Where Things Were Happening. A festival, or perhaps a gathering of friends? The specific instance didn't matter. Suddenly, I feel a hand grab mine. I look at him: his cheeks are flushed.
>you can be more intimate when we're together, you know.
The only thought that comes to mind as I stare deep into his eyes is how this is what I've always wanted, being able to feel something and having a relationship where words aren't needed to convey our thoughts.
I lean my face in closer, and so does he. Then I remember, and stop. It's just a dream.
He looks surprised at first, then mellows down into a pained smile. He understands; or rather, I do. Quite funny (in a heart-wrenching way) that I'm the one dismissing my delusions this time when I got rejected in real life.
Tears well up in his eyes, and so do mine. We hug each other and cry our hearts out until I've purged all of those burdensome emotions out.
I wake up. And while I'll never forget about that short period of bliss we had together, I think I'm over it now.
My first love lasted two months. I don't know when the next one will appear, or how long it will last, but I'm looking forward to it.
That was really sweet. I hope you find the your next one soon.
I'd just like to say that I really appreciate your post sushi roll (imo it's the only one with Truth ITT). May God bless you
>imo it's the only one with Truth ITT
Are you calling everyone else a liar in this entire thread?
WTF why would you say such a thing?
That poster actually forgot to say that their post was also truth. Ran straight into the Liar Paradox, didn't even see it coming.
God = Truth, take of that what you will sushi roll>>11232
Two years until wizardom for me.
You can talk to me, I'm flirty sometimes, maybe you can learn how to not act like a sex offender with me.>>11243
Same. My birthday is next week, then it's exactly 2 years from there, except I guess I become a witch instead(?), I'm already a christmas keiki.
same boat friend.>>11244
I'm not that sushi roll but I have the same problem. I feel like every time I talk to a girl I turn into a retard who probably creeps them out, and I just feel constantly judged for being weird. I missed the boat completely on learning how to interact with the opposite sex when I was younger and now I'm paying the price. So uh, can I talk with you as well?
>>11244>You can talk to me, I'm flirty sometimes, maybe you can learn how to not act like a sex offender with me.
I don't like talking through imageboards about intimate stuff. People can see what I'm posting and would make me a bit ashamed looking back to it later on.
I don't like plastering my discord
everywhere but I left it in the e-mail field if you wish to try that out
I realized after I posted it that talking to people online is very different to talking irl, so I'm not sure how useful I would actually be to you. We can still talk and be friends if you'd like!
>>11253>I realized after I posted it that talking to people online is very different to talking irl
That's actually true. Women with boobs in front of me and staring right at me turn me into stone, but online I really doubt there could be any issue>We can still talk and be friends if you'd like!
Sure, I'm fine with that
Are you sure you act as bad as you say? I felt like that for a long time too and beat myself constantly up for it. In the end it turned out I just didn't have the luck to encounter a girl that was attracted to me for a long time.
After it happened I also got the courage to ask her what kind of impression I made on her and she said she always thought of me as funny and intelligent. While we got to know each other I have thought countless times that I fucked it up and worried literally about anything I have said and done because I have changed nothing about my behavior and appearance.>>11243
I hope you are not kicking yourself because of it. Just carry on and don't drive yourself insane.>>11244
Is the female virgin experience any different from the male virgin experience?
Anyway I hope you are not getting yourself down because of it either, I have to admit that calling yourself christmas cake is worrisome.
>>11265>Are you sure you act as bad as you say? I felt like that for a long time too and beat myself constantly up for it. In the end it turned out I just didn't have the luck to encounter a girl that was attracted to me for a long time.
I think that mostly happens when I see someone I'd like to be with, but doesn't show any interest for me. If a girl is kinda interested in me, I wouldn't really act that weird because I don't have to worry about making a first impression. The problem is that I'm not that interested in the girls that are interested in me. If the girl is not interested in me and I really would like to be with her, I end up acting and looking like pic related.
I think there was a smiths song based on this topic.
Have you tried improving yourself to end up in the same league as them? Perhaps they will start to get interested in you.
Although it sounds like you are not doing bad already, because some already showed interest in you. Then what was wrong with those that did? Maybe you have simply too much expectations?
>>11269>Have you tried improving yourself to end up in the same league as them?
I am improving myself now, not because of women, but because your body can get really messed up if you don't take care of it>Although it sounds like you are not doing bad already, because some already showed interest in you. Then what was wrong with those that did?
Most of them were in highschool so it was a while ago, but the process that happened was this:>be interested in girl>try to talk to them>we get along>she starts showing interest in me>end up getting interested in someone else
That being said, it's been 3 years since a girl has shown interest in me so I can't say I excel in that subject>Maybe you have simply too much expectations?
I wouldn't say that, though I'll be honest, I was bullied in highschool, so a big part of not getting into any relationship back then was because I was scared that people would bully whoever I was with at the time.
I find talking about this really awkward because it makes me realize that maybe the reason why I'm alone is because I'm the kind of guy that goes for the top and doesn't care about the rest. Or maybe I'm just too much of an asshole, scared of commiting to someone, high standards, etc.
>>11265>Are you sure you act as bad as you say?
Pretty sure. Nobody has ever been interested in me and according to all data I can gather it's not because I'm revoltingly ugly but rather because I'm weird. It might be because of my virgin status or age or shyness or emotional-ness or hobbies or mannerisms or lack of a lucrative career, but that hasn't stopped other people who can have "confidence". I guess some of it might just be insecurity though. I've been on dating apps before but I almost never message anybody because I consider it a forgone conclusion that even if I trick someone into thinking I'm normal and desirable it'll all fall apart once it comes out that I'm a depressed virgin with anime figures. Who knows man.
Good to hear that you take care of your body, this can also help you too in that regard. Even though you don't do it because of women and that is honestly even better. You should take good care of yourself, no matter what, else you just ruin your health.
Strange that you just suddenly have an interest for someone else but according to that you can talk just fine to a girl that interests you?
This was very considerate of you to not drag someone else into this, unfortunately we will never know if a potential girlfriend would have suffered too or not.
My condolences for being bullied though, I experienced the same and it can severely damage your mental health, hopefully you recovered.
I think you should ask yourself that questions and reflect closely. Self-awareness helps a lot to better yourself and to gain more control about yourself.>>11272
Sounds to me that you just didn't find someone you click with yet. Perhaps you can improve too? You mentioned insecurity.
Dating apps are awful anyway, so don't worry about that, anybody bullshits everybody in some way there. I hope you are doing something against your depression though, I have been there and it can ruin everything if left unchecked.>>11271
I don't want to be rude but can you please not joke around like that?
In my humble opinion it is very precious that some dare to say that they are female on an imageboard. It shows how welcoming, comfy and overall quality an imageboard is. Usually shit hits the fan if something like that comes out.
I've found that acting aloof to someone you used to care about a lot that won't just reciprocate your feelings can take things to a whole another direction. They stop taking you for granted. At least this has been my experience and how I started dating with a certain someone I used to have a crush on.
Well, of course, since our relationship wasn't established on a healthy foundation, in hindsight I can say that it was doomed from the beginning anyway. This wasn't apparent to me at the time, I was sort of on a high that I got a significant other, and as with any other inexperienced, ill-fated teenager out there, I've made many mistakes. Feelings of inadequacy seeing them having more fun with their group of friends, emerging feelings of envy out of it, and the inevitable arguments led our relationship to doom.
As you can imagine, it didn't really last long, and at the span of a couple of months I've went from feeling like I was the happiest person on Earth to most unfortunate. It's a weird feeling, how you can see the same person under such a different light in such a short amount of time. Me and them, both.
I kind of started hating myself after this, it has been years already but I guess I'm still not over it. For the most part, I'm blaming myself. They messaged me a couple of months ago, from a different number since I blocked the first one many years ago, but I didn't really know how to reconcile my feelings so I blocked them again. I guess I'm still afraid, afraid of most people. I don't know how to fix this either.
>>11277>Sounds to me that you just didn't find someone you click with yet.
Well I'm kinda running out of time (at least for things like having kids) and it hasn't happened yet. Doesn't mean it won't and of course it's possible to date someone younger, but it's not promising for me.>You mentioned insecurity.
Well it's hard not to be insecure when I'm as old as I am and have as many issues as I do. But of course nobody finds insecurity attractive so it's something I have to find out how to kill.> I hope you are doing something against your depression though, I have been there and it can ruin everything if left unchecked.
I think it's already ruined a lot, too much maybe. I started seeing a psychologist recently though, and I do want to improve in that area, which is something I can't say has always been true.
>>11277>Strange that you just suddenly have an interest for someone else but according to that you can talk just fine to a girl that interests you?
That was like 7 years ago, I changed a lot with time. Let's say I "respect" a woman's space too much and don't want to bother them now, else I become creepy like I said before.
It also doesn't help that wherever I go there are either no women, or they're all taken, makes interacting with one frustrating.
most of the time its one sided and the ones it wasn't I got cheated on
good luck sushi roll
Thank you, sushi.
No answer until now, unfortunately her Facebook is the only thing I have found and it's very inactive too… Good chances that she never reads it or in a year or something.
keep us updated if something comes out of it
>>11453>she mentioned that reading a book of love letters between two female authors, which I gave her…for Valentine's Day .. ,.. made her want a relationship with another woman
This made my laugh, sorry about that sushi.
At least it didn't evolve into something nasty, take care of yourself now. Sushi is always there for you.
I'm pretty drunk but at this point I think I've accepted I'm just not suited for this love stuff. Or sex, or whatever. I guess I could probably keep trying but for various reasons I just feel like its all so hopeless. I just wanna be free of this desire entirely.